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 GeneRally 2 - Pre-Alpha Demo Released 
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Joined: Wed Jul 14, 2010 12:08 pm
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Post Re: Developer Blog
I agree with the day/night timing and headlights on too late/off too early. The split times are a great addition too.


Wed Apr 02, 2014 8:08 am
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Post Re: Developer Blog
I totally like it! I should write some things about the graphics but I dont do because I know its alpha version :) So I write about the physics.
Mainly feels good, but try to push the throtle, and the brake when you turn :D And you will have some turbo boost!

But 5/5 now! keep up guys! :D

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Wed Apr 02, 2014 8:26 am
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Post Re: Developer Blog
First off - thanks to everyone for the support and the bug reports :) This morning we're making/collating notes and targeting the improvements we can work on as we go forward. We're using these coming days to bug-fix and improve the quality of the demo for Kickstarter, so your feedback is (as always) incredibly important to us!

As Kimmo mentioned above, performance is something we're actively working on, though we won't be focussing too much time on this before we hit beta. For what it's worth, the performance of the stand-alone is far superior to the web player, as we've never developed with the web player (and its limitations) in mind. Shortly after Kickstarter, I'll be spending a few days changing the way the terrain works, to provide us with a (hopefully) significant performance increase :)

The car physics are something we're constantly working on - and, really, we were never going to be able to get right until we had community feedback. Markku & Kimmo have worked tirelessly on the physics engine, ensuring it's far more detailed than GR1 (to give car makers new options), whilst at the same time trying to ensure it feels like GeneRally. Many of the points highlighted here and across social media can be easily rectified by some tweaks to individual cars :)

Other than that, we're always hard at work (even if it might not seem like it :p) and hopefully we'll do you all proud ;)

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Wed Apr 02, 2014 9:00 am
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Post Re: Developer Blog
I haven't had much time to test but I have to say I love it so far. It's quite lagging to me and I'm not too keen on the sluggish cars either but I won't comment on the actual performance just yet.

What I do love is the way the road cones (great that you can have both standing and lying cones) and the hay bales act when you hit them. The car headlights are fantastic. I like trying to drive over the armcos with the Monstertruck but somehow it feels too random at the moment, sometimes getting stuck, sometimes not. And the tyre walls is a nice touch.

Apart from the sluggishness and lagging I think it feels like GR. Can't wait to see the next version!

About bugs, I ran into the same problem as Paw with my gf's laptop with Win8 - in the beginning I only get the blue screen and when I go to the settings, I can't see the two bottom on/off switches.

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Wed Apr 02, 2014 9:35 am
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Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2010 1:03 pm
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Post Re: Developer Blog
The physics feel really strange. I tried the Formula style car and it seems like the front end just "floats" when you hit a sunk tyre or go over hills, then it feels overly heavy everywhere else. It's kind of strange as if any weight/downforce disappears when the wheels are lifted. Still early days but it feels very different and I can't say whether I like it or not. Feels very slow too compared to the old cars, not that I think it's a bad thing though. I think I've figured out what seems so different about these physics and I believe when I was trying the mini, it felt like there was roll so it seems to still want to turn when you let go. If that is not a controller thing, then that feels fantastic, like there is weight and roll. :)

I hate to start with the negative but to be honest, it is looking fantastic. It seemed to run smoothly here. I'm starting to love the art direction more and more. The lighting is really a beautiful touch to this game

Should also point out that the menu style is fantastic too, even for the basic demo. I LOVE the split times over the car (seriously, that is a wonderful addition) and just the general style of the menus staying minimal. :bg:

EDIT: Yeah, that is oversteer/understeer. I'm impressed. :up:

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Last edited by Crowella on Wed Apr 02, 2014 10:28 am, edited 1 time in total.



Wed Apr 02, 2014 10:01 am
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Post Re: Developer Blog
Crowella wrote:
Should also point out that the menu style is fantastic too, even for the basic demo. I LOVE the split times over the car (seriously, that is a wonderful addition) and just the general style of the menus staying minimal. :bg:

Yes, these too!

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Wed Apr 02, 2014 10:07 am
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Joined: Thu Feb 04, 2010 6:02 pm
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Post Re: Developer Blog
I tried GeneRally 2, also with my brother... and I must say it's fantastic! I was a little bit scared about new physic but after 10 minutes I though "It was worth to wait for the sequel (even demo version)".

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Wed Apr 02, 2014 10:31 am
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Joined: Mon Apr 11, 2011 1:30 pm
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Post Re: Developer Blog
For the physics, for me it's between Generally 1 and this webgame : Mini Nitros

At least for the buggy, the sport and the formula.


Wed Apr 02, 2014 10:33 am
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Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2009 3:04 pm
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Post Re: Developer Blog
I noticed that with the ghost car bug the new track record doesn't get recorded if the too fast ghost has already crossed the finish line.

Oh man, I haven't been this addicted into hotlapping in ages. :D

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Wed Apr 02, 2014 10:53 am
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Post Re: Developer Blog
Yes, I have to agree that the split times are pretty awesome. I wasn't a big fan of hotlapping just for the sake of hotlapping in GR, but I think I would enjoy it a lot more in GR2 because of the split times. As for the menu, that was one thing that bugged me a little. I know it's just a pre-alpha, so I'm sure this will change to be more like the original, but I don't like using the arrow keys instead of the mouse to select cars. Once the carmakers get to work, people will have lots of cars in their collection. So it'll be a pain to scroll through a bunch of cars to find the one you want. Dropdown menus are a must.

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Wed Apr 02, 2014 11:30 am
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Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2009 5:30 pm
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Post Re: Developer Blog
Graphics are cool (especially those lights :yummy: ), but driving feeling really sucks. :2c: I hope that is because it's web-app and pc version will be much closer to original GR. That's what I want if you ask.

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Wed Apr 02, 2014 11:49 am
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Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2009 4:46 pm
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Post Re: Developer Blog
:iagree:
driving feeling is really bad in this demo, but I guess that's because of the webapp. Otherwise pretty promising :).

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Wed Apr 02, 2014 1:00 pm
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Joined: Thu Nov 21, 2013 8:36 am
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Post Re: Developer Blog
Buka wrote:
Graphics are cool (especially those lights :yummy: ), but driving feeling really sucks. :2c: I hope that is because it's web-app and pc version will be much closer to original GR. That's what I want if you ask.

Mad Dan wrote:
:iagree:
driving feeling is really bad in this demo, but I guess that's because of the webapp. Otherwise pretty promising :).

Webplayer in itself shouldn't bring any massive handling differences compared to a standalone build bar issues arising from performance/fps drops.

Could you guys having handling issues describe them a bit? Is it lag between input and action, slowness in general or something else? The feel is quite a bit different compared to the original GR cars and that's mainly because it's how I like it and I've had pretty much a free reign on how the cars handle so far (and I like them a bit unresponsive and slow) :mrgreen:.

But yeah, any descriptions on why you think the handling sucks (and which cars particularly suck) would be super helpful in tweaking the handling, thanks!

Crowella wrote:
The physics feel really strange. I tried the Formula style car and it seems like the front end just "floats" when you hit a sunk tyre or go over hills, then it feels overly heavy everywhere else. It's kind of strange as if any weight/downforce disappears when the wheels are lifted. Still early days but it feels very different and I can't say whether I like it or not. Feels very slow too compared to the old cars, not that I think it's a bad thing though. I think I've figured out what seems so different about these physics and I believe when I was trying the mini, it felt like there was roll so it seems to still want to turn when you let go. If that is not a controller thing, then that feels fantastic, like there is weight and roll. :)

The stuff you described about the formula car is mainly because of how downforce is applied at the moment. And it is as you described: the downforce only affects the car when the wheels touch ground. It really is a temporary hack before we get something that works properly and doesn't cause weird behaviour. Well, the current behaviour is a bit weird too, but it was the lesser of two evils at the time it was done. The car feeling heavy is also because of the downforce.

Also yes, there is indeed body roll and pitch as the car can move freely on its suspension. This causes the loads on the tyres to be different when accelerating/braking/cornering and gives you a mild feeling of oversteer/understeer. The effect most apparent on monstertruck as it has quite a big body movement.


Wed Apr 02, 2014 1:27 pm
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Post Re: Developer Blog
The mini and the muscle car are fine when they keep tuching the ground.

The monster truck is ok, we just have to get used with the new body roll and pitch. Maybe this Physic is too important.

The formula is weird, like the flat sports car, I have the feeling i'm rotating the car around a point.

The buggy is also strange as I have the feeling that I can't take a turn without oversteer. I have the feeling that the rear wheels are making the direction. Same thing happens with the rally car, but not so hard.


Wed Apr 02, 2014 1:42 pm
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Post Re: Developer Blog
Hello,
I wondered where the unity webplayer is inside the webpage till I found out that is doesn't work under Linux. So I would really appreciate it if you offer a downloadable version of the alpha for Linux users since the final game will be offered for Linux. This could help the KS campaign as well.

The comments on the alpha sound promising so I'm really looking forward to try the game. Keep up the good work :bg:


Wed Apr 02, 2014 3:45 pm
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Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 11:13 pm
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Post Re: Developer Blog
I agree that the physics do feel a little slow, but they aren't too bad, either. Plus, carmakers will start making things that have all sorts of different handling, so I'm not overly concerned with the default car physics, but I think that they shouldn't differ too much from the GR1 cars. And I'm wondering how much the webplayer lag is playing into the percieved physics issues. Maybe a downloadable KS pre-alpha should be available so we can test it as it would actually be played, it's kind of hard to properly evaluate physics when you are dealing with input lag. The lag caused me to oversteer a lot.
As for specifics, yeah, the buggy was way too loose for my liking, and the formula was too stuck to the track, it didn't really feel like driving a proper GR car with almost no sliding at all, and felt a little slow, also. I think the mini was nice, the rallycar wasn't quite quick or slidy enough, and what I assume was the Yankee felt pretty good to me, also. Maybe needs to steer just a tad bit better.

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Last edited by puttz on Wed Apr 02, 2014 4:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Wed Apr 02, 2014 4:25 pm
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Post Re: Developer Blog
I tested again :

You definitly turn by pusching the rear of the car, more or less, to the outside.
And I hope it will not end up with a drift game. Because I noticed faster speed sideways than without any slide.


Wed Apr 02, 2014 4:28 pm
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Joined: Thu Nov 21, 2013 8:36 am
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Post Re: Developer Blog
Glen wrote:
I tested again :

You definitly turn by pusching the rear of the car, more or less, to the outside.
And I hope it will not end up with a drift game. Because I noticed faster speed sideways than without any slide.

We actually had a turning system that worked by rotating the front tyres much like a real car would but found it to be awkward, inconsistent, extremely understeery and thus non-fun. The current system, which indeed rotates the car directly, is actually much closer to what GR1 has.

Some cars are indeed faster to slide around (the rally car being the prime example), but others like the Yankee (the big muscle car thing) really reward proper racing lines and taking corners carefully. The cars have a parameter which define how much % of grip they can lose in a slide so the car makers can make easy-to-slide cars like the original General for example or very knife-edge cars that lose a lot of grip the moment they start sliding. And when we take tyre wear into account it will be better to use cleaner lines in a long race as the more slip you have the more you wear the tyre and lose available grip.

OT: can anyone beat my epic time of 30.56 with the Yankee? You really need to be clean and precise with that car ;)

roteiro wrote:
Hello,
I wondered where the unity webplayer is inside the webpage till I found out that is doesn't work under Linux. So I would really appreciate it if you offer a downloadable version of the alpha for Linux users since the final game will be offered for Linux. This could help the KS campaign as well.

The comments on the alpha sound promising so I'm really looking forward to try the game. Keep up the good work :bg:

We'll look into this. We initially chose the webplayer as we felt it was the easiest way for people browsing the eventual KS page to try the demo. But a standalone linux (or windows for that matter) build should be possible.

EDIT: found this on the interwebs
http://www.gamingonlinux.com/articles/u ... ight-.2996
You can try if that works while we sort out the possibility of a standalone linux build :)


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Wed Apr 02, 2014 5:45 pm
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Post Re: Developer Blog
TheZkip wrote:
Glen wrote:
We'll look into this. We initially chose the webplayer as we felt it was the easiest way for people browsing the eventual KS page to try the demo. But a standalone linux (or windows for that matter) build should be possible.

EDIT: found this on the interwebs
http://www.gamingonlinux.com/articles/u ... ight-.2996
You can try if that works while we sort out the possibility of a standalone linux build :)

Thanks for the link, I googled as well but missed out that there is an easy-to-use ppa (Good stuff, was searching for a possibiliy to use Silverlight under Linux, Pipelight looks promising for this).
Anyway installed it, enabled the unity-3D-plugin and set the user-agent as described here. But no luck, the demo still doesn't show up. If anyone is successful on this, let me know.

Apart from this, I think that it's still much more complicated than a downloadable version of a game (Ubuntu people would probably prefer a .deb :D). People who don't know GR will very likely give up if they browse your demo page with a Linux system.

€: This Game here plays so my installation seems to work in general.


Wed Apr 02, 2014 6:36 pm
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Post Re: Developer Blog
After bit more playing I like most of the cars, not the sport car and formula (like some others). Also the tyre barriers remind me rather concrete walls, not a feeling of hitting something softening my crash (contrary to GR red soft wall). Finally (and mentioned already too) hay bales are way too light, in theory their point on track is to bit safely slow down the car before it hits something hard, but it does almost nothing to car speed atm.

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Wed Apr 02, 2014 6:42 pm
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Post Re: Developer Blog
Trigger Happy wrote:
After bit more playing I like most of the cars, not the sport car and formula (like some others). Also the tyre barriers remind me rather concrete walls, not a feeling of hitting something softening my crash (contrary to GR red soft wall). Finally (and mentioned already too) hay bales are way too light, in theory their point on track is to bit safely slow down the car before it hits something hard, but it does almost nothing to car speed atm.

I forgot to mention this in my post, I too noticed the rather concrete behavior or the tire barriers. They should be soft and absorb more of the impact like the current soft walls. Also agree on the hay bales, they shouldn't be as easy to move as a cone. Some movement, yes, but significantly less than what they do now. And having them against a concrete wall should be able to prevent nearly all movement of the bales, like they are sometimes used in GR1 as soft barriers along a concrete wall.

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Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:37 pm
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Post Re: Developer Blog
TheZkip wrote:
OT: can anyone beat my epic time of 30.56 with the Yankee? You really need to be clean and precise with that car ;)
Attachment:
ACM_Yankee_KSDemo_hotlap_30.32.png
I like the general heavy feeling of the Yankee.

The Buggy handles very much like how I envisioned my Meyers Manx to handle, so I was pleasantly surprised by its presence.

The Formula and Group C are very twitchy. — As if one is guiding a missile through an obstacle course rather than driving a car on a track. I may have to look to other cars for my balanced racing purposes.


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Thu Apr 03, 2014 12:24 am
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Post Re: Developer Blog
ACM wrote:
The Formula and Group C are very twitchy. — As if one is guiding a missile through an obstacle course rather than driving a car on a track. I may have to look to other cars for my balanced racing purposes.


I had to agree with this. I dislike Formula's behavior of flying when running sunk tires and Group C's stop-in-a-dime braking after laps of driving it.

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Thu Apr 03, 2014 1:49 am
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Post Re: Developer Blog
Ah, one thing I noticed. I hope that you will make it possible to have the large office blocks without the air conditioners on top? Because it would look strange and also probably make a big hit on framerate, especially on lower-end computers. And also, it looks like the new office blocks will not work as well to combine to make city streets or more unique buildings. I hope there is a version of the office block that will have a flat top so that we can put a bunch together to make fancier buildings like in GR1.

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Thu Apr 03, 2014 2:01 am
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Post Re: Developer Blog
Looks good! :)


Thu Apr 03, 2014 2:57 am
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