GeneRacing - Update Thread [old]

Here you can discuss other GeneRally-like projects.
User avatar
Kikwik
Posts: 436
Joined: Thu Aug 09, 2012 8:02 am
Location: France

Re: GeneRacing-alpha 0.0.7h preview (texturequality improvem

Post by Kikwik »

I have to disagree about colors but I understand what you said.

13 colors have been the standard from the beginning so it may be weird to see new colors, hd textures and so on in tracks.

But despite having the same shared colors, tracks were all different not mainly because of colors, but because of their personality and creation skills.

I will always remember Trigger Happy for his neat, super precise but simple fictional tracks. I'll always remember Garbre, PitbullFIN and vira lata for their awesome work on landmap. Dragon for his micro tracks, Glen for his innovative trackmaking methods and ideas, Masa for his fun and generous world. TuomoH for his experiments which stretched the possibilities of GR... (Sorry for the ones I forgot, you are more than 1000 trackmakers so :D )

I think our style will still be as different as it may be in GR, as we'll always recognize the work of an artist, whatever the support he uses to.


... However I'm agree with you with physics, but if it's drifting car physics we can call it quite good ? Have to work on the other ones now. :D

The Unofficial Archivist of GR1 - Founder of the GR Database
User avatar
Elharter
Posts: 51
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:13 am
Location: Vienna

Re: GeneRacing-alpha 0.0.7h preview (texturequality improvem

Post by Elharter »

content deleted
User avatar
Elharter
Posts: 51
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:13 am
Location: Vienna

Re: GeneRacing - Update Thread

Post by Elharter »

content deleted
jefcam
Posts: 99
Joined: Tue Dec 29, 2009 4:56 pm

Re: GeneRacing - Update Thread

Post by jefcam »

can the alpha versions be tested?
jefcam
Posts: 99
Joined: Tue Dec 29, 2009 4:56 pm

Re: GeneRacing - Update Thread

Post by jefcam »

Hello Generally community friends...

I am closely monitoring this new 'gene-racing' project by Elharter.
Last edited by jefcam on Wed Jan 05, 2022 5:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
zgr
Posts: 1523
Joined: Thu Jan 28, 2010 11:57 am
Location: International

Re: GeneRacing - Update Thread

Post by zgr »

Just randomly found out, that there will GeneRacing, so my "GeneRally 2" if you want :D
I abstolutely love it! I remember how I found GeneRally like 15 years ago. And I'm not that active anymore, but damn, reading things like online support, more cars, day/night, how can I be NOT excited :D
Please keep up the beautiful work!

btw, is it possibly to be an alpha tester? or at least test one alpha at some point?
Hello.
User avatar
FRUKIScze
Posts: 1608
Joined: Fri Sep 14, 2012 6:57 pm
Location: Czech Republic
Contact:

Re: GeneRacing - Update Thread

Post by FRUKIScze »

zgr wrote:...And I'm not that active anymore, but damn, reading things like online support, more cars, day/night, how can I be NOT excited :D
Please keep up the beautiful work!
Same feelings here :bg:
zgr wrote:btw, is it possibly to be an alpha tester? or at least test one alpha at some point?
I don't think I could bring any useful feedback, but if you plan on doing some big online test race, count me in :yummy:
4 times pole-sitter in GRPL F2. Future GRPL F2POSTPONEDrace winner. 1 time best of the rest qualification in GRPL F1.
(last edit: 18/09/2020)
User avatar
Elharter
Posts: 51
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:13 am
Location: Vienna

Re: GeneRacing - Update Thread

Post by Elharter »

content deleted
BrianH
Posts: 10
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2011 12:59 am

Re: GeneRacing - CarImporter now functional!

Post by BrianH »

Nice! Already in my Steam wishlist. How many cars will be able to race together?
User avatar
Elharter
Posts: 51
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:13 am
Location: Vienna

Re: GeneRacing - Update Thread

Post by Elharter »

content deleted
User avatar
Elharter
Posts: 51
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:13 am
Location: Vienna

Re: GeneRacing - CarImporter now functional!

Post by Elharter »

content deleted
User avatar
Crowella
GeneRally Trackmaster
Posts: 489
Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2010 1:03 pm
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia

Re: GeneRacing - CarImporter now functional!

Post by Crowella »

You're coming leaps and bounds with this now. Also whoa, 3,500 tracks 😯
View my archived circuits/cars here
User avatar
puttz
Posts: 1985
Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 11:13 pm
Location: The good ol' US of A

Re: GeneRacing - CarImporter now functional!

Post by puttz »

That is a lot of tracks! Will it be possible to import any track from the original GeneRally? Also, with the car importer, will importing GeneRally cars be supported at some point?
April 2012 rookie of the month, winner CoM Nov/Dec 2013 (NASCAR CWTS 2013), Jan/Feb 2014 (NASCAR Sprint Cup 2014) and Sep/Oct 2014 (TUDOR USC GT Lemans), Winner 2013 Competition Organizer Rabina Award
Volcano Motorsports
Check out my stuff
Owner and promoter of NAGRCA
User avatar
Elharter
Posts: 51
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:13 am
Location: Vienna

Re: GeneRacing - CarImporter now functional!

Post by Elharter »

content deleted
User avatar
puttz
Posts: 1985
Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 11:13 pm
Location: The good ol' US of A

Re: GeneRacing - CarImporter now functional!

Post by puttz »

Elharter wrote: Wed Dec 02, 2020 10:07 am
puttz wrote: Wed Dec 02, 2020 1:42 am That is a lot of tracks! Will it be possible to import any track from the original GeneRally? Also, with the car importer, will importing GeneRally cars be supported at some point?
Yeah it is! Of course we´ve got support from existing GeneRally Users to reach this count of tracks :D

And yes, every track greater version 1.05 is compatibly! Of course we didnt tested all of the 3.500 tracks now.
At the moment we´ve tested around 300 Tracks, with different sizes, styles, etc - and they work all.

CarImporter will be changed because of changed physics, etc. But the "visual part" could be imported to get a 1:1 look.
So, at the end its possible to say "every car is importable" :) :bg:
Obviously I wouldn't expect the physics to be the same as original GeneRally, but nice to know we will be able to import the car models :cool2:
April 2012 rookie of the month, winner CoM Nov/Dec 2013 (NASCAR CWTS 2013), Jan/Feb 2014 (NASCAR Sprint Cup 2014) and Sep/Oct 2014 (TUDOR USC GT Lemans), Winner 2013 Competition Organizer Rabina Award
Volcano Motorsports
Check out my stuff
Owner and promoter of NAGRCA
User avatar
Elharter
Posts: 51
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:13 am
Location: Vienna

Re: GeneRacing - CarImporter now functional!

Post by Elharter »

content deleted
User avatar
Elharter
Posts: 51
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:13 am
Location: Vienna

Kickstarter in preperation! Deep insights for the community

Post by Elharter »

Some insights, just for you:
generacingonKickstarter.JPG
User avatar
Black Rebel
GeneRally Trackmaster
Posts: 483
Joined: Thu Apr 01, 2010 9:52 pm
Location: No one knows.

Re: Kickstarter in preperation! Deep insights for the community

Post by Black Rebel »

Looking better everyday.
jefcam
Posts: 99
Joined: Tue Dec 29, 2009 4:56 pm

Re: Kickstarter in preperation! Deep insights for the community

Post by jefcam »

genracing.jpg
User avatar
Elharter
Posts: 51
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:13 am
Location: Vienna

GeneRacing - new pitbox crew animations

Post by Elharter »

Check this out:

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJQ23tRgRz0[/youtube]
gif.gif
Crouching, falling down, lolipop, ready, wheel changing new!

Follow us on kickstarter now:
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/ge ... acing-game
jefcam
Posts: 99
Joined: Tue Dec 29, 2009 4:56 pm

Re: GeneRacing - new pitbox crew animations

Post by jefcam »

I am sure this man will develop soemthing interesting for all. Let us not miss this opportunity!
User avatar
Elharter
Posts: 51
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:13 am
Location: Vienna

Official Statement

Post by Elharter »

Official statement:

We were, by James B., prohibited any use of the Generally-TRK files. Furthermore, we are not allowed to link to Generally or to mention or use the name "Generally" on our site.

Of course, we will follow this request or request and remove all related content that may occur in the next days and weeks.

A possible license option or collaboration was first offered and after rejected by James, which we very much regret.

With this in mind, we prefer to develop the existing file format (* .grt - GeneRacingTrack) in our priority list and disclose it. The file format of course already existed and is functional, details will follow shortly.
With the opening of the file format we hope for the support of the community for the maintainability, changeability and creation of Tracks for GeneRacing in order to let the community grow even faster.

In addition, we put the first, small and simple, TrackEditor version on the priority list number 2 in order to be able to offer the options for creating a track. The current development, v1, should be available for testing in the next 2-3 weeks, the development is already running.

The 0.0.7j update will be postponed.

The Kickstarter campaign is of course still running and waiting for the start :)

We are still working on the first set of FullHD tracks - be prepared!

greetings



Michael
User avatar
James
GeneRally Trackmaster
Posts: 283
Joined: Thu Dec 31, 2009 7:26 pm

Re: Official Statement

Post by James »

Elharter wrote: Wed Dec 30, 2020 11:51 pm We were, by James B., prohibited any use of the Generally-TRK files. Furthermore, we are not allowed to link to Generally or to mention or use the name "Generally" on our site.

Of course, we will follow this request or request and remove all related content that may occur in the next days and weeks.

A possible license option or collaboration was rejected by James, which we very much regret.
This is getting a bit out of hand. I had written a post about how I felt Michael wasn't being very fair in his portrayal of my actions, but instead I decided to post the emails I sent to him, as I have absolutely nothing to hide in this regard.

I won't post Michael's emails, because I feel that would be infringing upon his privacy, but he can post them if he so desires (though I'd appreciate if he redacted my personal information from them, if he decides to do so). He may not have intended what he said to be read publicly - and I should respect that.

For clarity here, there have been other, successful, projects that have taken heavy inspiration or influence from GeneRally - and this is the first time any action of any kind has had to be taken. The difference here is that GeneRacing has been attempting to use, and have used, things they don't have the rights to use - coupled with what we feel is a deliberately-confusing name. This has already led to people confusing GeneRacing for GeneRally - but none of this was too much for us to try and find a solution that worked for everyone. I proposed this licensing agreement with the intention that it would benefit everyone (including Hannu & Jukka) - and allow the GeneRacing guys to continue development unabated.

With that said, here are the emails...

First email to Michael (sent 14.12.2020) - this is my first contact with Michael:
Hi Michael,

I hope this email finds you and your family well - especially in the current world situation. I've emailed you via this address, as it was the only one I could find for you. I'd be grateful if you could let me know a preferred email address for further communication - you can reply to me at this address.

I'd first like to say that I think the progress you've made on your game is great - it looks fun and seems to really be trying to capture the essence of the history of this genre/style of game.

The first reason I have to email you is pretty straightforward, though: it is our belief that "GeneRacing" infringes directly upon the trademark right of GeneRally and, as such, this email is to ask you to change the project's name.

The European Intellectual Property Office would regard such names, being in the same classification, as "confusingly similar" and, as such, an infringement of GeneRally's trademark. GeneRally has 18 years of "prior art" in regard to this trademark.

I wanted to get to this point as soon as possible, as I'm aware you're about to begin fundraising using this name and I want to make sure that you have the opportunity to change the name with minimal impact to you. I also want to ensure this doesn't become a problem complicated by commercial use of the infringing name.

I'm required to send you this email both for business reasons, and for trademark-enforceability reasons.

The second reason I need to cover is the use of "GeneRally" and "GeneRally compatible" terms in your marketing. This poses two problems: firstly, using the GeneRally trademark to promote your product (which also implies endorsement); and secondly the potential use of copyrighted information to provide GeneRally compatibility.

As you may or may not know, most of the track format knowledge that exists in the GR community is as a result of Hannu, Jukka or myself providing information to people developing tools for GR for non-commercial use. I have interacted directly with a lot of these people in recent years, to provide them with up-to-date information solely for their non-commercial use in producing specific tools.

If you have obtained your knowledge of the GR track format by this means (in part or in whole), then I must ask that you stop using this feature in your product. We can, of course, discuss licensing of such functionality if you feel this is a core part of your product (but this will not cover the use of the "GeneRally" name, which we intend to protect).

As alluded to earlier, this really wasn't an email I wanted to have to write - but I hope we can find a quick and amicable solution to this that doesn't negatively affect your project. It's really inspiring to see GeneRally-inspired projects like this get built and move forward and I'll look forward to trying your game at the point it's more widely available.

Kind Regards,
James
.
Michael replied to me on 24.12.2020, but as mentioned above, I won't put his emails here, as they're his to disclose. I'm firmly of the belief that emails between individuals are private information - but I'm also not interested in having words put in my mouth :)

Second email to Michael (sent 24.12.2020):
Hi Michael,

I'm disappointed you chose to go this route. Even more so that you have only filed your mark in Austria after the date of my email.

You've made an error in assuming I did not seek appropriate advice about this before contacting you. The email I sent initially to you was sent with advice, including confirmation from the EU IPO that registration of a confusing mark with an in-use mark (even unregistered in the EU IPO database) is not permitted. Registration of a mark is simply that: registration. It does not have any effect upon the holder of the rights to that mark.

During the EU IPO trademark application process, they do not process any obstacles to registration other than by objection by rights holders. They informed me that it is simply impossible for them to verify the validity of each mark automatically during the registration and, as such, acceptance of an application and even acceptance of the mark is not a clear path to continued usage - pre-existing usage always supercedes registration (in this, you are incorrect that priority of filing is relevant - priority of usage is all that matters).

Unfortunately, disputing this formally will end up costing us both money - and this was what I sought to avoid in my initial email to you. I will act to defend the "GeneRally" mark against all unlicensed usages.

Regardless of this matter - I am not beholden to provide a licensing option to you. You are, however, required to cease utilisation of GeneRally's proprietary material until such a time as you have permission to use it. I am not willing to engage in a licensing agreement discussion with you whilst you are unwilling to cease your trademark infringement. Please consider this a formal notice that you do not have the appropriate permission, license or right to utilise GeneRally's intellectual property.

With this in mind, you should immediately remove all references to GeneRally from your marketing materials (this includes removing the screenshots of GeneRally from your Steam page).

I had hoped to come to an amicable solution to this. My ideal situation had been that you would have considered changing the infringing name, and we would have come to an agreement on your usage of GeneRally's proprietary material. This would have been a solution that would have been beneficial for all parties (which you claim to also hope for).

As it stands right now, all this will lead to is money that could have been spent on furthering the retro, top-down racing game genre (based on a title we both have long-standing fondness for), being spent on a trademark dispute.

You cannot claim for this project to be non-commercial whilst simultaneously advertising a Kickstarter campaign, and promoting a Steam page. Businesses do not need to be profitable to be considered "commercial" in usage. You are not permitted to make any commercial use of the GeneRally name, intellectual property or proprietary material.

I will be monitoring the EU IPO Trademark Bulletin and preparing to file a formal objection to your application there.

Sincerely,
James
.
Michael replied again to me on 26.12.2020 and there has been no further correspondence since then.

I'm only posting these here to clear up my side of things, I'm not interested in getting into a public dispute over this. All I'm interested in is correcting the false claim that I "rejected" working with GeneRacing, especially when I was the one who initiated the offer.

I had hoped my next post on this forum would have been on a much lighter note - but we don't always get what we want :)

Happy New Year to everyone. Let's hope 2021 is a bit less dramatic than 2020 (in the real world, and in this thread) :banana:
User avatar
Elharter
Posts: 51
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:13 am
Location: Vienna

Re: Official Statement

Post by Elharter »

James wrote: Thu Dec 31, 2020 6:31 pm I'm only posting these here to clear up my side of things, I'm not interested in getting into a public dispute over this. All I'm interested in is correcting the false claim that I "rejected" working with GeneRacing, especially when I was the one who initiated the offer.

I had hoped my next post on this forum would have been on a much lighter note - but we don't always get what we want :)

Happy New Year to everyone. Let's hope 2021 is a bit less dramatic than 2020 (in the real world, and in this thread) :banana:
I also prefer direct and personal clarification of these things. As you have already stated yourself here, I have not received an answer to my last email until today. But thats okay, i think the status is clear and solved. Its just a bit weird if you say "I'm not interested in getting into a public dispute over this" while not answering my email.

In this last email, too, I have repeatedly asked for a proposal to submit an offer.
As you posted by yourself:
James wrote: Thu Dec 31, 2020 6:31 pm I am not willing to engage in a licensing agreement discussion with you whilst you are unwilling to cease your trademark infringement.
so what now? Is my statement correct or not?
To this day I have not received a usable offer. So I am not claiming this, it is a fact.

As i said in my last email, a small insight to remember:
From our point of view, we are welcome to talk about any possible cooperation, but the name change is impossible for us due to the factors mentioned.

If we want to start a mind game: we change the name, get license rights to use generally parts ..... the result would be exactly the same, name or not. The only thing which is changed that we loose all our followers and marketing invests until today.
So it's obvious what the goal here is - changing the name would not change anything.
Even after changing your name, there is a high probability that you would not have made a realistic offer to use the license, obviously.

Should you want to reconsider your stance on naming, which does not violate any word marks, we are still open to discussion.

Again despite all the circumstances: Merry Christmas!

Kind regards




Michael
Happy new year too from our side! No drama at all, two opinions, two points of view. we can talk about everything.
User avatar
Elharter
Posts: 51
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:13 am
Location: Vienna

Re: Official Statement

Post by Elharter »

Edit: I changed the first official statement text to "A possible license option or collaboration was first offered and after rejected by James, which we very much regret" so that it is no longer presented as an assertion.
Locked